Nikko Targetmaster 10-50x60 - worth a gamble?

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  • Nikko Targetmaster 10-50x60 - worth a gamble?

    G'day Gents,

    Firstly, I am well aware of the reputation Nikko Stirling have, and have owned 3 (still have one on the 22). I know that they are not a Schmitt and Bender.

    The targetmaster 10-50 has me intrigued and I was wondering if anyone has any first hand experience with this particular scope.

    I have a "trophy tactical" 5-20 on my 204, and for 400 bucks I consider it a good buy (ray trade sells these. - they are a nightforce rip off). The reason I mention this is that it is almost identical to the nikko Targetmaster 5-20. So much so that I'd place a decent wager that the same factory in China makes both scopes.

    This leads me to think that the 10-50 that cleavers are currently selling for 249 bucks might be of the same quality (lower end, but totally functional) and a good stop gap while I save for something decent. I totally expect that at 50x the image would be like looking through a cloud, but I wonder how they might be at 30-40x.

    Intended use is beginner f class. I figure I can recoup 150 bucks or so when it comes time to put some nice glass on.

    Anyone shot, used or looked through one?

    Thanks in advance, and please go easy on the man who can't afford to put a nightforce on every rifle he owns

  • #2
    Gee mate, I'd have a look first hand if I were you. I currently have a 5-20x50 TargetMaster on my Howa, and while it's pretty ok it's got terrible eye releif. Clarity is ok at 20x but it's sometimes hard to hold a picture through the tube. Other than that it does the job well enough until I muster the courage to drop the coin on a Burris Eliminator mk3.
    Not suitable for mature audiences

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    • #3
      I have not used one!


      my uneducated points on nikko and a little educated knowledge on shooting fclass go like this:

      * You dont need 50 power to shoot Fclass.

      *Most higher power scopes have less elevation. Most cheaper scopes have less elevation. Combined the two and I am GUESSING the Nikko may not have the adjustment to make the distance.

      *With Fclass you shoot at different ranges and will turn the turret quite a bit. Is the Nikko going to repeat well enough to not make you sad?

      *When turning up to a rifle range and shooting in a scored competition are you willing to trust a cheap chinese scope?

      *When you make a bad shot do you blame yourself, your load or your scope?


      JH


      *

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      • #4
        I agree with John.
        I wouldn't slap a chinese scope on a target rifle. It will cause you large amounts of grief. Cranking the turrets will destroy a cheap scope sooner or later.
        I've seen a Nighteater get killed by less than 50 shots on a .243
        If you can, hold off for a while longer and put the money toward something decent that will serve you well. Bushnell, Leupold, Vortex, Sightron etc will do a better job and they come up second hand every now and then.

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        • #5
          If you can put another $150 with it, you can have a 4-16 power sightron with plenty of elevation, and a good reputation for repeatable settings and durability. As well as a better resale value.
          I have a cheap scope of another brand which worked pretty good for about 8 shots on a .308, now it lives in the shed.
          A poor quality scope that changes point of aim will do your head in while you chase shots.

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          • #6
            If you like a gamble and about the same chances as wining tats lotto yes.
            If you prefer to not loose money and hate disappointment then NO.
            [center]
            Don’t poke the snake, walk around it and come back later with a double-barrelled shotgun and blow its [email protected]#!ing head off!.

            Australia in future, the outcome is the same, a bloody dictatorship run on the whims of a very few ego-centric pathological elitists.

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              NoFerals - I've had a ticket in every $5 jackpot draw for two years (over 100 tickets) and have not won so much as a a free ticket- I shit you not!

              That aside, thanks for the advice guys (particularly John). I hadn't even thought of moving turrets and repeatability of adjustment. Being that I haven't done any target work, I've strictly been a set and forget -If the scope holds zero it's been fine for hunting.

              My brother has a Weaver t-24 doing nothing that he may part with for a small fee, but I'm not sure whether a fixed power scope is a good idea or not.

              What zoom range would you guys recommend? Distance will ultimately be out to 1000, but i can't see myself bothering with that distance for a long time (600 absolute max for the time being).

              I really just want to get something on the rifle so I can get shooting quickly, hence me looking at budget crap as a stop gap, but if it 's going to be a hindrance, maybe I will just sit on the rifle for a bit.

          • #7
            Borrow the weaver and try it out. Should do the job nicely.

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              Originally posted by Needbiggertargets" post=33532
              Borrow the weaver and try it out. Should do the job nicely.
              I'd read that mirages made fix power scopes a bad proposition - is this true?

          • #8
            When mirage is bad, the sight picture can be improved by reducing the magnification. With a 24 power scope it will only be a problem on the very bad days, depending on what your range is like. My partner uses a 6-24 power scope, and it hasn't moved off max yet.

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            • #9

              Have a look at these scopes.
              They are well worth saving for if you are starting out.
              The beauty is if you get one with the varmint reticle you wont need to wind anything just zero it a 200 yds and use the ranging reticules out to 600 yds and the windage dots for learning wind and holdover and aiming off is arguably better than chasing wind with adjustments on the turrets especially if your new to the target game
              Later on if you decide to get serious then a bigger 25 x T target model is a good thing set up on a 20 moa rail and zeroed at 300 yds and will get you to 1000 yds easy enough with out breaking the bank on scopes twice the price [though they are definitely in a better range ].
              If at some point you decide to only hunt they [4.5-14 x50 VX#-L series]are an excellent scope for any rifle under a 284 or some other big banger.
              The 14 x don`t have any parallax adjuster so its just some thing less to go wrong and be finicky with.

              Front bell adjusters are easily damaged so I don`t really like them though they will work ok / just don`t like them.
              I don`t have any affiliation with the brand or dealers I just like these scopes though the price is perhaps a bit inflated..
              Make sure to get a genuine one and not some knock off as I do believe they exist you can read on the leouplod web page / warning message/how to identify the genuine ones by the serial number under the body by the adjustments turrets.

              Well worth the time and patience to save for I bet you never sell one if you do decide on it.

              http://www.leupold.com/hunting-shooting/scopes/vx-3l-riflescopes/vx-3l-4-5-14x50mm
              [center]
              Don’t poke the snake, walk around it and come back later with a double-barrelled shotgun and blow its [email protected]#!ing head off!.

              Australia in future, the outcome is the same, a bloody dictatorship run on the whims of a very few ego-centric pathological elitists.

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              • #10
                If you can get your hands on the weaver T that your mate has , go for it.
                If I buy a second target rifle (omark or neilsen on the wish list) I would like to fit a Weaver T36.
                They are a scope that is seen on some very high end BR rifles. I think that speaks for itself.

                As for backing your scope power off???
                What for?? You dont need a Crystal clear image to shoot targets (one of the reasons I did not mention Nikkos poor glass)
                Plus if you can work it out the mirage will give you a indication of what the wind is doing when the flags are not doing much,

                So I guess what I am trying to say is a fixed power scope would be just fine for shooting Fclass

                JH

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                • #11
                  ........................Buy once, Cry once.......................
                  Do not pass GO. Do not collect $200.

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                  • #12
                    A Weaver T would be good if you can lay hands on it.
                    As for mirage it varies.
                    Normally 20 to 24 is ok except on very bad days -- this will depend on your location.
                    I have seen on a hot stinky windy day , mirage take a target picture into almost an oblong wobbly blurr wit no definable edge at all --not shootable with out holding off at least the size of the black itself.
                    This was at one hundred yards and the range is on a salty old river flat covered with bindii and a bit of small shrubby niter bush and native boxthorn.
                    The sort of country you would find near the coast in some places of dry country.
                    That was with a 12 x variable scope needed taking back to 4 x to see at all.
                    Normally most blokes can get away with 20 x even on bad days so the weaver would be fine.
                    A 50 x would be absolutely useless in those conditions.

                    Believe it you can have too much magnification so you will see all your wobles and a pulse from your shoulder muscles or cheek.
                    This will teach you to have absolutely no confidence in your aiming and you will end up snatching shots when you think thye might be on target --end up getting poor scores --doubting your self and your gear and bugger you as a shooter forever.
                    You are better with a clear low magnification than an over clear too high one that shows too much.
                    32 x will do that and 50 will do it worse.
                    YOu need to be a good shooter and very sure of your self first to use 50x and IMHO you would be starting at the wrong end of the scale.
                    You couldnt get a ferrari off the strat block unless your a very good driver with lots of skill and super high mag scopes would be the same in comparrison for a novice shooter.
                    Walk first run later.
                    [center]
                    Don’t poke the snake, walk around it and come back later with a double-barrelled shotgun and blow its [email protected]#!ing head off!.

                    Australia in future, the outcome is the same, a bloody dictatorship run on the whims of a very few ego-centric pathological elitists.

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                      Originally posted by NoFerals" post=33591
                      A Weaver T would be good if you can lay hands on it.
                      As for mirage it varies.
                      Normally 20 to 24 is ok except on very bad days -- this will depend on your location.
                      I have seen on a hot stinky windy day , mirage take a target picture into almost an oblong wobbly blurr wit no definable edge at all --not shootable with out holding off at least the size of the black itself.
                      This was at one hundred yards and the range is on a salty old river flat covered with bindii and a bit of small shrubby niter bush and native boxthorn.
                      The sort of country you would find near the coast in some places of dry country.
                      That was with a 12 x variable scope needed taking back to 4 x to see at all.
                      Normally most blokes can get away with 20 x even on bad days so the weaver would be fine.
                      A 50 x would be absolutely useless in those conditions.

                      Believe it you can have too much magnification so you will see all your wobles and a pulse from your shoulder muscles or cheek.
                      This will teach you to have absolutely no confidence in your aiming and you will end up snatching shots when you think thye might be on target --end up getting poor scores --doubting your self and your gear and bugger you as a shooter forever.
                      You are better with a clear low magnification than an over clear too high one that shows too much.
                      32 x will do that and 50 will do it worse.
                      YOu need to be a good shooter and very sure of your self first to use 50x and IMHO you would be starting at the wrong end of the scale.
                      You couldnt get a ferrari off the strat block unless your a very good driver with lots of skill and super high mag scopes would be the same in comparrison for a novice shooter.
                      Walk first run later.
                      I agree somewhat.

                      Unless shooting with a bipod these things should not matter. If using a front and rear rest like most people why would you have your cheek, hand and shoulder touching the rifle?
                      Get your body off the rifle, let her do her thing. Thats the way I roll anyway, Touching it causes inconsistency and will show things like heart beat ect.

                      Im not suggesting its wrong to shoot gripping your rifle with cheek weld , I am just saying its a lot harder and dose not provide any gains imo.

                      JH

                  • #13
                    I think you would do better to buy a scope that may have less magnification but with better quality optics, you may have to stretch your budget but as has been stated - buy once, cry once. If you borrow the Weaver to get you started, go for it but I would recommend a variable because mirage can be a PITA when shooting long distance, personally I use a Nightforce BR 8-32 on my F-Class rifle and out here in Central QLD shooting over blacksoil I know all about mirage ( haven't mastered it yet ), there have been times when I could not use more than 10 or 12 power but on the odd occasion when I can use 32 power it is awesome. I am not saying you need to buy a Nightforce just trying to say that quality optics would be of more benefit than loads of magnification that you can't use.
                    That's my 2 bobs worth.

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                    • #14
                      Thanks for all the tips guys - it's great to be able to get good advice to easily. I'll see if my Bro will part with fixed Weaver as a stop gap.

                      I'm no stranger to good optics having spent many years of my career behind $60k surveying equipment, but was still blown away this morning after I made the mistake (insofar as bad for my wallet) of looking through a Nightforce at my LGS. Suffice to say, I'm going to start saving my pennies!!

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                      • #15
                        yea i agree inthe less body inluence on the rifle grip the better to a point.
                        Certainly in small bore I found that to be true.
                        In big bore I like to control the recoils as much as possible with positioning of my shoulder.
                        Twist of the rifle off a front and rear rest and a good stock.
                        Trigger control by thumb on the same side as the bolt handle.
                        I learned today that a single hold over DOT is easier to center than cross hairs at 300 meters on 25 x.
                        Never really having given much thought to using mil dots and holdovers rather than adjusting all over the place and loosing the plot in the process I now think its possibly easier for me.
                        In a physical eyesight thought that makes sense as they eyes try to line up all circular objects better than deal with a mix of circles and a cross hair.

                        Free recoil I tried with abysmal results but might be fine on a light rifle with low recoil -- I get no feeling of confidence when trying it.
                        Cheek weld often results in pushing shots side ways for me, as its an unconscious reaction when your about to fire.
                        I think Cheek weld is probably or possibly a hangover from the days of prone shooting with slings when it did make a lot of difference.
                        Bench rest is not prone so you need to learn all over, and its the future so go with the flow sounds good to me.

                        Plenty to learn yet and so few years left to learn it in I should have stayed on with big bore when I started back in 72.
                        The biggest mistake I made.
                        The thing I learned even as a B grade shooter is your never too old to learn some thing new and adapt to it.

                        Lots of fun rifle shooting
                        [center]
                        Don’t poke the snake, walk around it and come back later with a double-barrelled shotgun and blow its [email protected]#!ing head off!.

                        Australia in future, the outcome is the same, a bloody dictatorship run on the whims of a very few ego-centric pathological elitists.

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