Sanity Check - Reloading 38spl with AS30N

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  • Sanity Check - Reloading 38spl with AS30N

    This is the first time I'm reloading and have a Lee Classic Turret Kit and Lee dies (4 set). I'm using AS30N to reload 38spl for Cowboy Action.

    According to the ADI load data my minimum load is 2.5gn with HRBC 125gn RNFP. I've set my correct OAL and the crimp is in the crimp groove.

    I've set up the Lee beam scales following the instructions but when I dispense 2.5gn in the brass case is barely 1/3 full. Is this correct? Out of curiosity I can file the case with 3 charges before it is close to the rim.

  • #2
    If I remember correctly AS30 is ADI's fastest burning powder???

    Anyway, you will find your chamber pressures get pretty high pretty quickly with a small charge.

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    • #3
      yes that's about right, make sure you don't double charge. It's usually best to start with the slowest burning powder on the list, which is the bottom powders. I use ap70.

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      • Guest's Avatar
        Guest commented
        Editing a comment
        You said that the minimum charge with that powder, I wouldn't throw three lots in just cause the case will hold it in volume. I have heard of compressed loads where the case is full and the proj. squashes it down, but what powder were they using?

        Other than that IGNFI.

      • Guest's Avatar
        Guest commented
        Editing a comment
        Just had a look at the ADI manual and the starting loads for AS30 behind a 125gn pill is right
        One of the guys at the range must have told you to load that low.
        I dont think you guys have to meet any power factors.. but still..
        The 38spl case is short, but the problem you may encounter more then the high pressures is irregular ignition patterns using so little powder.
        most of your case will be empty..
        Service pistol shooters do similar loads but they push a 110gn wadcutter some of the way into the case so the air gap is reduced..

        I would go 3.2 gn AP50, it would fill the case better or better still use trail boss.

        if AS30 is all you have for now use it with 2.5 but pack a bit of tissue in the case to hold the powder low next to the primer flash hole..
        People have been using fill media like tissue, cotton wool, rice, corn husk and anything else they have laying around to fill the case.

    • #4
      I'm using the Lee Pro Auto Disk Powder Measure which uses cavities of set size so I'm not sure how it can double charge but I do visually check each charge to make sure there's a charge.

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      • Yoshie
        Yoshie commented
        Editing a comment
        Originally posted by TheOtherLeft" post=22925
        I'm using the Lee Pro Auto Disk Powder Measure which uses cavities of set size so I'm not sure how it can double charge but I do visually check each charge to make sure there's a charge.
        sometimes when you press binds up you can short stroke and double stroke, also if the press fails to index and you don't notice you can double charge. I went to Trailboss because i was having a few fail to ignite due to low volume, but it doesn't meter as well thru the auto disk as ap30, ap50 and ap70 does.

    • #5
      Originally posted by TheOtherLeft" post=22911
      This is the first time I'm reloading and have a Lee Classic Turret Kit and Lee dies (4 set). I'm using AS30N to reload 38spl for Cowboy Action.

      According to the ADI load data my minimum load is 2.5gn with HRBC 125gn RNFP. I've set my correct OAL and the crimp is in the crimp groove.

      I've set up the Lee beam scales following the instructions but when I dispense 2.5gn in the brass case is barely 1/3 full. Is this correct? Out of curiosity I can file the case with 3 charges before it is close to the rim.
      If you google ADI their website comes up, there is a great deal of information to be had, with different powders, pressures etc.
      Or better still try and get a copy of the ADI powders, this covers all firearm loads, Western Action to flintlock.

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      • #6
        The starting load for 125gn projie for Western Action is 2.5gn AS30N as per the ADI manual

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        • #7
          If you want to further expand your repertoire of reference material for AS30n, check for Hodgdon Clays powder loads. Clays is Hodgdons brand name for AS30n. Quite popular in the States for 38 special loads.

          I use 2.3 gns behind a 148gn DEWC in 38 special.

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          • #8
            Thanks but I have 1000 x 125 gn RNFP projies to go thru first.

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            • Guest's Avatar
              Guest commented
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              Originally posted by TheOtherLeft" post=22989
              Thanks but I have 1000 x 125 gn RNFP projies to go thru first.
              We can finish that off for you in one morning session..

          • #9
            Are you shooting these out of a .357 chambered firearm? If so you can start up at the maximum load as it is still half the pressure that a .357 can take and it will still be a pip squeak load.

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            • #10
              Originally posted by TheOtherLeft" post=22911
              According to the ADI load data my minimum load is 2.5gn with HRBC 125gn RNFP. I've set my correct OAL and the crimp is in the crimp groove.
              I've set up the Lee beam scales following the instructions but when I dispense 2.5gn in the brass case is barely 1/3 full. Is this correct? Out of curiosity I can file the case with 3 charges before it is close to the rim.
              Yes it is correct!
              That is a very mild load.
              Don't worry even a double charge is unlikely to hurt your gun. I use a lot more with a 158gn round nose with great success.
              Yes there is a lot of air space left in there. The Special cases can take a lot of powder - you will never get a compressed load with such fast powders

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              • #11
                Do not add a filler. There will come a point in time, when a ringed chamber or barrel will occur, or if it doesnt, the chance will be high if you shoot enough of it.

                The info in regards to pushing a projie, "all the way in", is INCORRECT. There are some loads were a projectile is partially pushed, in, but never, all the way.

                Thanks,

                Oddball

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                • Guest's Avatar
                  Guest commented
                  Editing a comment
                  Originally posted by Oddball" post=23053
                  Do not add a filler. There will come a point in time, when a ringed chamber or barrel will occur, or if it doesnt, the chance will be high if you shoot enough of it.

                  The info in regards to pushing a projie, "all the way in", is INCORRECT. There are some loads were a projectile is partially pushed, in, but never, all the way.

                  Thanks,

                  Oddball
                  Hi Oddball
                  Fillers have been used in loads for decades and are still used today, they have their own associated issues but ringing a barrel is not one of them.
                  Using a suitable filler like rice, corn husk or other wading will not ring your barrel.

                  You have two terms Ringing and Bulging a barrel,
                  Ringing occurs when you leave a coat of oil in your barrel or if it has water inside the barrel when you fire it.
                  The projectile when fired starts to push the oil or other liquid up the barrel at a point it cant push or displace the liquid and starts to go through it, because liquid will not compress something has to give, in this case the barrel will form a bulged ring around the inside of the barrel where it skipped or passed through the liquid.

                  Bulging occurs when a heavy or difficult to move obstruction is lodged inside the barrel and a second round is fired, this can be subtle due to barrel fowling or extreme, in the case of a projectile being stuck in the barrel, when the second fired projectile impacts the lodged projectile energy is transferred to move the projectile, excess energy not used to move the projectile is radiated into the barrel causing expansion.

                  I have corrected pushing a projectile ALL THE WAY into a case.
                  Pushing a projectile all the way into a case is not hazerdous, the problem you have is the case wall is tapered and is thicker at the base.


                  this was the only cross section of a rimmed case i could find.

                  Pushing a projectile to far down into a case will either expand or bulge the case so it wont chamber or it will swage the projectile reducing its diameter effecting accuracy/performance.

                  Deep seating projectiles is mainly practiced with revolver rimmed cases like 38 specials, 357 and 44 mag where power factor requirements are considerably lower then normal.

              • #12
                I am using 2.2gr AS30 in a 38 spl case with a deep seated (2mm below case mouth) 100gr SWC.
                This does decrease the air gap but does not compress the powder.

                I have used 3.5gr AS30 with a 158SWC seated to the crimp groove without issue (for >120PF).
                Once I use all my AS30 I am switching to AS50. Only reason is that I could not get AS30 when I wanted it.

                You will find that at 2.5gr with a normally seated 125gr projectile they will all fire with no problems. Best check
                speed over a chrono though as the velocity will be relatively low. Will be plenty of drop once you go out past 25yds too.

                Have fun.

                Regards Murph

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                • #13
                  heavens no

                  AS30 is a real fast burner very little will be in the case. Fill it to the top and you will be meeting your maker, or at least your revolver will.

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                  • tomo
                    tomo commented
                    Editing a comment
                    Just re read the post seems you wern't going that far just testing. 3.5 gr of AP30 will fill about just under a 3rd of the case so no problem there.
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