Pig Bullets

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  • Pig Bullets

    What kind of alloy would work for shooting pigs?

  • #2
    Originally posted by okeefenokee" post=20498
    What kind of alloy would work for shooting pigs?
    An alloy of a type that could be placed in an area that will kill the pig......

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    • Guest's Avatar
      Guest commented
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      Touché old chap :lol:

    • inverness
      inverness commented
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      Any reasonably hard alloy should work ok eg:COWW or even 50/50- ww/pure with a gascheck.
      More importantly I would consider the type of bullet, & I would lean towards one with a large meplat or perhaps a cast HP.
      But it is also true that shot placement is one of the biggest factors.

  • #3
    What cartridge are you using as this will have a bearing on the type of alloy and bullet design.

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    • Guest's Avatar
      Guest commented
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      Have not decided between 45/70 and 444R. Been speaking to a bloke in a Distant forum and his cast 444 bullets are Huge for that calibre. 300 grains and 340. That is almost 45/70 country.

  • #4
    I beg to differ to most of the posts re hunting with cast bullets. You will get best results with the softest alloy at moderate velocity that will work in your rifle. I have shot many hundreds of pigs with my 30.06 driving a relatively soft 210gn bullet at 1700fps with an alloy with only 4% tin. Most of the recovered bullets in the attached photo are actually from game and are even softer 2.5% tin (1:40) at under 1500fps (520gn 45/70, 250gn 45LC, 420gn 45/70, 457 RB, and 86gn 25/20 taken from a fox)

    Soft alloys deform much easier, transfer energy and provide spectacular kills that hard cast which tend to act like FMJ's and just punch ineffective woulds through out soft skinned Australian game.



    This is my 30.06 pig rifle with cast hunting loads

    .
    Hold still varmint, whilst I plugs ya!

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    • #5
      Great information BAW. What powder are you using under the 210grain 1:40 .30 loads? Do you tend towards a fast pistol powder or a slower powder like 2207/2208 in order to get velocity without nose slump/deformation using that soft alloy?

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      • #6
        What fascinating replies. You have all given me much to think about

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        • Guest's Avatar
          Guest commented
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          Hey Wallace, whats your thoughts on Lyman #2 Alloy?

          I have around 80kg of, and it measures around 15.2 BHN on my measure... it has no arsenic in it so thats as hard as it will ever get.

          I figure its going to be a good hunting pill in .30 cal with a GC and Hi-tek coating... I figure around 2,000 FPS would be fine. Have not had a chance to confirm lately, finding it hard to get out.

          Using .312 155gr C312-155-2R LEE for the 7.62x39, and .309 180gr C309-180-R for the .308 win.

      • #7
        I use 32.0gn 2206 for 1700fps.

        Hunting with cast requires a LOT of thought about just how that alloy performs. First within the barrel it has to be accurate and not strip in the rifling, not even a little bit. I can fire at least 40 rounds without cleaning.

        Now it hits the game, energy is transfered by deformation and "dwell time". A soft bullet that deforms will transfer energy by expanding the nose to present more bearing area to the flesh and secondly, because the soft bullet is driven slower that bullet deformation has more time within the flesh to transfer even more energy.

        A very hard cast bullet driven at 2000fps+ will do just the opposite, minimal expansion and short "dwell time". I have seen hard cast bullets go through a pig just like an FMJ military projectile and merely punch a small hole. The only saving grace is if it happens to hit bone, then it will expand and transfer more energy.

        The old Kynock catalogue used to list "big game" ammunition loaded with cast express bullets as being an alloy of 1:16 or about 5.5% tin which is softer than the Lyman #2 alloy (8% tin)

        This deformation and "dwell time" also figures when shooting metalalic silohuettes and I have seen solid hits with very hard cast bullets richochet off while the soft pill transfers coupious amounts of energy while deforming on the steel.
        Hold still varmint, whilst I plugs ya!

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        • Guest's Avatar
          Guest commented
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          Do you test your BHN?

          My "Lyman #2" I make myself out of virgin metals mostly... 5% tin, 5% antimony formed from a 70/30 mix of Pb and Antimony, and 90% lead.
          BHN is 15.2 to 15.4.

          Copper gas checks and Hi Tek Coating... these babies should be good to go I reckon, with minimal leading in the barrel from the coating... still need to test these theories.

      • #8
        VMAN
        "testing theories" Somebody hasta doit

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        • #9
          Of course when it comes to pigs no amount of lead is too much: right up to a 615gn 58 cal (r)

          Hold still varmint, whilst I plugs ya!

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          • Guest's Avatar
            Guest commented
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            Sweeeeeettt

          • Guest's Avatar
            Guest commented
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            Somewhere iv seen a cast projectile that had a hollow base, flat nose, so when it backwards it was a hollow point, frontwards a wadcutter, good idea IMO.

        • #10
          Most useful cast bullets for hunting would be in the BHN 12 or less way down to BHN 5 and the way that I duplicate my 'formula' each batch is to weigh the projectiles. As an example, a 190 gn .303 (when cast of No. 2 alloy), when cast of pure lead weighs 204.6gns. By adding tin the weight of the alloy reduces until I reach a bullet weight of 194.6gns.

          Bullet hardness measurements are an imprecise science; bullets cast from the same pot can, and do, give different hardness values due to the nature of the measurement. In addition, alloys that on the surface appear to be identical can produce bullets with widely different hardness's based solely on issues like casting technique, mould temperature, pot temperature, and where and how the bullets are dropped. The results you obtain may, or may not, agree exactly

          Cast bullet hardness can change for up to 48 hours after the casting process but the weighing method for determining composition can be immediate whether the cast bullet is hot or cold!
          Hold still varmint, whilst I plugs ya!

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          • #11
            Hey there Bad Ass Wallace,
            don't mean to jump in on the thread but you got me interest on the 86gn 25-20.
            Could you please tell more, bullet type, rifle?
            Please? M a t e !

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            • #12
              Mould is a CBE plain base catalogue No. 257.086, it is a accurate load with 4.5gns AP70 for 1340fps

              CBE are back in business and have an updated web site!
              Hold still varmint, whilst I plugs ya!

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              • LtFrankDrebbin
                LtFrankDrebbin commented
                Editing a comment
                Originally posted by Bad Ass Wallace" post=25044
                Mould is a CBE plain base catalogue No. 257.086, it is a accurate load with 4.5gns AP70 for 1340fps

                CBE are back in business and have an updated web site!
                Cool, thanks for that.
                I do have CBE 257-80 along with with Lyman 257-420 and RCBS 25-85 (modified). Have used W231, AP-50, Trailboss, AR-2205, AR-2207.
                Just started playing with AP-70 broken firing pin put a stop to that. Awaiting a new one to arive. Also looking into addressing a bad oversize chamber problem. Sportco barrel Winchester 92.

                Have you by chance seen the 25-20 reloaders thread over on Marlin Owners.

                Sorry to jump in off topic guys, it's those magic numbers I tell yah 25-20

            • #13
              Hi Lieutenant,
              This thread is an education for me, so don't apologise. I love it

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              • #14
                moofy07
                Sad to say but I have decided agaist buying a new H & R. Reports on MO are not positive on reliability. I also wonder whether the Oz retailer has parts back up but to be fair to them, I have not asked. In addition, my Rossi is playing up again and it has put me off cheap guns until I get over it
                As for your cannon, I hope you live long enough to father a long line of descendents

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                • moofy07
                  moofy07 commented
                  Editing a comment
                  Originally posted by okeefenokee" post=32606
                  moofy07
                  Sad to say but I have decided agaist buying a new H & R. Reports on MO are not positive on reliability. I also wonder whether the Oz retailer has parts back up but to be fair to them, I have not asked. In addition, my Rossi is playing up again and it has put me off cheap guns until I get over it
                  As for your cannon, I hope you live long enough to father a long line of descendents
                  My 45-70 is a Marlin GBL and it handles the heavy stuff very well. :P
                  I have already fathered two beautiful girls so that's not a problem.
                  The H&R I have is 300 Blackout.
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